Thanks to all who responded. The overwhelming majority of users said to "load the carto.avp file it gives you hatches that when printed are transparent. double click on your theme in the table of contents of your "view" then double click your symbol, then click on the pallete icon to the far right, then select load and navigate to your symbols folder and press The likely path name is c:/usr/esri/av_gis30/arcview/symbols, select from those new hatches and they'll work. these hatches are vector the others I was trying to use are raster. " reeves@NTSG.UMT.EDU